Wk 4: Automatic Drawing

123 responses to “Wk 4: Automatic Drawing”

1. 

   Shalane Holm

   September 14, 2016

   The Mind in the Cave was a very interesting video about the cave art is Lascaux, France. This cave art is from 16,000 years ago, and was discovered by a 17 year old boy. This cave has always fascinated me due to the fact that it is the most extensive, most well preserved, and largest of its time, ever discovered. The Hall of the Bulls in particular is the most awe inspiring to me. That a group of people could create paintings of bulls on the walls, that are easily recognizable to us today, without any sort of previous works of art to reference, blows my mind. Professor Zucman brought up the bird man, who has appeared throughout multiple cultures since the time of this cave painting. To me, he must be a figure that evolved and changed as humans multiplied, expanded, and mixed. He could be the fundamental basis for even the Christian’s Christ. I find this to be no coincidence, but a connection between cultures all the way back to time before time. Zucman touched on the comparison between the bird man and the movie The Matrix. That is an interesting comparison, yet I am more intrigued by the idea of the bird man being connected to multiple religions’ figures of focus. Interesting video that really made me think!

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   1. 

      pizzagreaterthanyou

      September 15, 2016

      Hi Shalane, I agree about what you said about the Hall of the Bulls. That topic caught my attention and researched more about it. I also find it amazing how creative and imaginative these people were and expresses it on the cave wall. I also find it interesting how other group of people drew horses and other drew bulls. Were they trying to communicate or just leave a mark? Who knows. This is cool though.

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      1. 

         pizzagreaterthanyou

         September 15, 2016

         ^^^ Joy Uba 1pm

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      2. 

         beentiredblog

         September 18, 2016

         Kayla Tafoya Sablan

         Hey, Shalane! Okay I totally agree how the cave itself as far as its size and depth is crazy in and of itself besides everything hiding inside of it. I’m actually pretty surprised that it was barely discovered in 1940 though. I feel like it would’ve made sense that it was discovered much earlier. Still doesn’t take away the wow factor though. I’m just surprised how recently it was discovered. It’s interesting that the painting were only of animals they didn’t hunt. But then again things like cattle and bulls were often worshiped and idolized by early natives. I’d love to experience this kind of art. These people were amazing artists is completely mind blowing.

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   2. 

      lukasfue

      September 15, 2016

      Lukas Fuentes (1pm)

      Hello Shalane! I think your point about this “broken man” figure comparing to other faith’s characters is very interesting. I also do not think it is a coincidence. There are many different faiths that have this similar Christ figure. This is not the only thing that modern religions have in common with more ancient faiths. For example. there are several faiths that all have their own unique Noah character (survivor of the great flood), including the Greeks. So I totally agree with you that these characters just get evolved, tweaked, etc. to fit into a different faiths beliefs, but essentially are the same character. Very interesting, indeed.

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   3. 

      amanateeseawarrior

      September 16, 2016

      Amanda Martinez
      Hi Shalane! I agree with you that it was no coincidence that the bird man has occurred throughout different cultures. Since people do like moving around the idea of a reoccurring figure could have been spread through word of mouth which would explain the variations across different cultures. As stories get told and retold people forget pieces and fill in the blanks with whatever thought comes to mind. This is the same idea with religions and you brought up Christian’s Christ. The idea that stories change overtime and different people having their own perspective could also be the reason for so many forms of Christianity.

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   4. 

      irepbrian

      September 18, 2016

      Brian Sath

      Hey Shalane,

      I agree that the video about the Lascaux cave was interesting. It was surprising for me that the cave was 16,000 years old and was discovered only in 1940 by a 17 year-old boy. It was truly indeed that it was really large and well preserved. I felt that the Hall of the Bulls was the most beautiful area of the Lascaux cave. It was intriguing that the painting of bulls on the walls could be recognized by humans. It makes me wonder what inspired the people of that time period to start drawing and how they came up with the materials. The bird man concept was very interesting that the person may have gone on a spiritual trip and died and then came back as a shaman. It’s interesting that the bird figure was found throughout multiple time eras and how it could resemble a religious aspect.

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   5. 

      Adrian Munoz

      September 18, 2016

      Wow Shalane,
      That’s actually a great point, the possibility the bird man represents many cultures including the Christian’s Christ seems more likely than the Matrix. I just think the Matrix is a far stretch, but I guess it’s relevant. I also agree that the paintings of the bulls are just amazing. I’m just really curious of how they made it and how they preserved it for so many years. I just want to add a question, why a bird? I’m guessing birds were demonic, I don’t know, but if I was in that cave I’d probably see a child crawling on the wall or something like that.

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2. 

   pizzagreaterthanyou

   September 15, 2016

   Joy Uba
   1pm

   In the video, he mentioned about the Hall of Bulls but did not have the time to go over it. Since it is known as one of the best-known Upper Paleolithic art, I did some research on it. I searched up a picture of it but it was kind of a blur at first glance. My first thought when I saw it was “what is going on.” To me, it was kind of confusing so I had to really absorb and digest what I was looking at. I thought that right away, I was going to see bulls but I was wrong. The first thing I saw was a horse. Then as my eyes finally settled on the artwork, I finally saw the bulls. It was very interesting because some of the drawings overlap each other. Maybe it’s because the cave was painted by different painter at different times and they would just draw over it. I just thought that this was pretty cool and interesting and I’m glad I searched it up.

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   1. 

      adamshannah96yahoocom

      September 18, 2016

      Hannah Adams posting:
      Joy, I agree with you about the horses. They actually were the animal painted most in the Lascaux caves. This is what I find most interesting. Wild horses must have been very common at the time of these paintings, and I wonder what primitive people thought of them. Horses were domesticated in 3500 BCE, so I wonder if these people were already starting to observe these animals and try to think how they could be useful.
      I also was interested in the number of paintings, Joy. I asked in another post how the artists were chosen. If it was every member of a tribe that participated, or just a shaman or other leader. I also wonder what significance art first held for people. I would love to know who the first artist was. And what they were thinking when they scratched on a cave wall, or traced their finger in soil. Art has been with us since our early days, and I would love to know how its meaning has changed over the years.

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   2. 

      allison cruz

      September 18, 2016

      Hi Joy! I had to do the same completely! I was also confused as to how someone could get so much information out of such a simple painting. I found that some of the bulls were overlapping to simulate movement. As for the shamen, I was confused on how they saw a bird and found that it was almost reincarnation. I suppose that is why they have professionals who do this for us! I also feel that way when I look at abstract art. Anyways, it is all very interesting and great to know more about.

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3. 

   lukasfue

   September 15, 2016

   Lukas Fuentes (1pm)

   I think the ideas of Shamans and the process of becoming a shaman are very interesting, for several reasons. The ancients thought that the shaman had to go through a vision question to gain his powers of being a medium between the divine (spirits, supernatural, otherworldly, etc…) and humans. As a scientist, it is always interesting to hear what is actually going on during these vision quests. Apparently, as mentioned in the video, they are just entering another state of consciousness due to the excess of carbon dioxide they are inhaling that was produced naturally by the cave. I’ve also heard this being the case for priests of certain Roman gods, as in there was natural carbon dioxide being produced in the shrines of these gods and the priests would enter that other state of consciousness and people thought they were speaking with their god. The other reason I found the shaman characters interesting is because, as mentioned in the video, this is a reoccurring theme throughout time. Jesus died on the cross, was resurrected and is now thought, be people of the Judeo-Christian faith, to be mankind’s savior. Shaman’s went through a vision quest, had a “death” experience and came back from that experience to help guide their people. This theme is still seen in modern times (Neo in The Matrix or Jon Snow in Game of Thrones). This theme is likely to stick around for some time if history is any indication.

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   1. 

      Stephanie Arciva

      September 15, 2016

      Stephanie Arciva
      Hi Lukas!
      Ahh! I love the fact that you took that theme and saw it in Game of Thrones! I love that show! I remember that experience Jon Snow had, and he has had such an influential role from that experience. It is interesting to find that this theme may be incorporated into our lives closer than we think. It is even more amazing to think how long this theme has survived. I think these extraordinary experiences continue to surprise me right from the start! Beginning from these “vision quests” that are a little odd to me, extending to our world today! It shows how we tie more similarly to our history then we think. It draws us closer to these events that we don’t know about because they happen around the world. I find it intriguing that these instances relate us to people around the world as well as people in our history.

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   2. 

      Nick Lemmerman

      September 16, 2016

      Hey Lukas. In my post I also talked about the reoccurring theme of someone dying, being reborn, and leading/saving their people. It baffles me how it’s survived all the way up to this point in time, and will most definitely appear in future stories. But from you, I didn’t know that the CO2 inhalation was a common thing. I mean, sure, I’m sure people get together and pass around a bottle of it. But I didn’t know, e.g. The Romans did it as well. I suppose being in an altered state of mind will make you do anything, but it’s interesting that the Romans also believed they talked to their gods, just as the cave painters (potentially, we don’t truly know) believed they were performing spiritual things, etc.

      — Nick Lemmerman

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   3. 

      Selena Lara

      September 18, 2016

      Hello Lukas, Hope you are well!
      I too found it interesting how at the time these communities didn’t know that they there minds were being altered by CO2 inhalation. In reality, it just makes me question if they were ever in their right mind. I mean, sure they didn’t know but would the lack of CO2 in these vision quest make their decorative caves as impactful? Would the idea of the broken man move across cultures as it did?

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4. 

   Stephanie Arciva

   September 15, 2016

   Stephanie Arciva
   For this week’s discussion video, we traveled to decorative caves around the world. I found this video particularly interesting considering how these caves were created as surface water eroded away the limestone because I take personal interest in the beauty of Earth’s natural wonders. What I felt most resonating with the video was how these caves were incorporated into a “vision quest.” It puts into perspective not only the dangers of these caves, as the depths of them were leaking carbon dioxide, a toxic gas, but the culture of these people. Although there have been speculations to what rituals were celebrated in these caves, it draws to the beauty of the wonder. No one will know exactly what happened or what someone experienced when they went on these vision quests, similar to the mystery behind what these caves meant to the people. We are left with these beautiful phenomena to interpret through there everlasting art. I imagine looking at these caves is like stepping into a different world. Although these caves signified a place of importance, I found it a little haunting to think of what lied far into these caves. Whether it have been an effect from the carbon dioxide or even hallucinations, I find it a little scary that these people entered these caves looking for that “altered state of mind.” Overall, this was an interesting insider that allowed me to be intrigued as well as scared!

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   1. 

      Tina Nguyen

      September 17, 2016

      Hi Stephanie!
      I like how you bought out the mysteries in caves and the stories that they can tell. I never thought of the somewhat creepy side about caves in that we don’t really know what truly happened because we were never there. Historians can make all types of guesses based on the evidence found in caves but we won’t know 100% if that was true.That mystery is what I believe life to be all about because we never know what happens in life in regards to our future for we have yet to reach that point in life. Like you said, I guess that’s a little bit haunting but at the same time I find it is what makes life worthwhile.

      -Tina Nguyen

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5. 

   Roxana Chavez

   September 15, 2016

   Hearing the story of how the Lascaux cave was discovered in southern France is very interesting especially since a 17 year old Marcel Ravida discovered it. I have explored some caves in Mexico but never seen caves with drawings or any of that sort. It is something I hope one day I get to experience. As Professor Zucman said in the video the caves were not somewhere they lived in it was somewhere they had celebrations and maybe rituals. There draws I feel have a connection to the celebrations because as they where having a good time they maybe drew on the walls so when they would come back for a new celebration they could remember their previous celebration. Who knows? I also found it really interesting how they drew the bulls. Maybe they drew the bulls as a sign of appreciation that they had towards them. Or maybe even stories about their lives with these animals. I am also intrigue in how they drew such amazing paintings. Like the the Hall of Bulls which left me as viewer in a ”Wow effect” and that was only through google images. I wonder how amazing it would be to actually see them in person. It makes me think how they did it. How long must of it had taken them to do such paintings and how did they create their utensils to draw and paint?

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   1. 

      aleahlomeli28

      September 17, 2016

      HI Roxana! I agree with you on how their drawings told a story and how significant it was for them to be able to refer back to those memories. I am sure one day you’ll get to experience something like this in your own way! 🙂 I think even today we still capture the celebrations, although the world has changed and technology has evolved, we still make memories. There is so many questions unanswered and I’m with you on that, I wonder how they did these painting and why?

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   2. 

      lozano1021

      September 18, 2016

      Araceli Lozano

      Hey Roxana,
      I have always wanted to explore caves in mexico, that’s awesome that you got the chance to. it reminded me of this past spring break when I travel to mexico and went to check out some land my dad owns in the sierra part of mexico. We came across this cave and wanted to go in and explore t but i didn’t. I regret not getting off the horse and at least taking a glimpse of what was inside. I was scared that an animal was in there and was going to attack lol.
      I definitely began to wonder why they drew so many bulls and horses. I know that the horses and cattle were brought from europe to the US and Mexico so seeing so many of them depicted on the cave made sense. However. I did question what they wanted the carvings adn paintings to represent. As you stated maybe it was because they found them interesting. Maybe it was because they were writing out a story that had happened with these animals. It makes the mind wonder and maybe one day we’ll know what they were trying to say.

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6. 

   amanateeseawarrior

   September 16, 2016

   Amanda Martinez
   The Lascaux cave being 16,000 years old and still intact is incredible. Cave art gives people today an insight on culture during the time period that the paintings were created. Since they did make paintings of things that are still recognizable today means maybe human culture still has not changed very much since then. I looked up images of the hall of bulls section of the cave and noticed that there is a large bull on one end face a group of animals on the other end. Some of them may also be bulls or even horses, but the thing that stood out to me is that the large bull stood alone. This made me think that maybe the people who created these images saw bulls as strong animals that were able to protect themselves or they saw being like a bull as being a leader. In the video Professor Zucman mentions that people used to go on vision quest in the cave. I was not sure what a vision quest was so I looked it up and it is a rite of passage that is an attempt to achieve a vision of a future guardian spirit according to google. Perhaps the bull represents their future guardian spirit which could also explain why they did not find any bones from bulls.

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   1. 

      Raylyn Diep

      September 17, 2016

      As I watched this video, I also wondered what was the significance of the bulls to them. I can see that it stands as a strong figure and is like their guardian spirit. The times these people lived in must have been tough, but they lived through it. They had to become strong in order to survive. As stated in the video, they were hunters and gatherers. They also moved around a lot. Maybe that is why these people look up to the bull as if it is their guardian spirit. The bull is seen as big and strong. It seems like it could overcome any obstacle in front of them.

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7. 

   Tina Nguyen

   September 16, 2016

   Upon hearing the word cave, I thought of a small tiny arch rock that you can go inside. I didn’t think about all the rich history and art that caves could provide. I think it’s so cool that people discover art caves especially Marcel Ravidat who wasn’t even that old when he discovered a cave. I found it cool how people use to use caves as a place to hang out, and that caves offered as a special place for people to gather and hold spiritual meetings. We know this from the evidence on the caves such as painting and fingerprints. I looked up Lascaux 2 on the Google, and I was just amazed by the talent that people have. Lascaux two is located in France. Lascaux contains about 2,000 different images that can be grouped into three different categories: animals, humans and abstract signs. Most of the animals drawn are cattle and bison, but there are some birds, bears, rhinos and humans. One other interesting thing I found out about these caves, is that there is a problem with them in that fungi is growing and covering the beautiful art. I hope that humans can do something to continue preserving the art.

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   1. 

      Tina Nguyen

      September 16, 2016

      ^^Tina Nguyen

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   2. 

      Vincent Santos

      September 18, 2016

      Hey TIna yeah I thought it was interesting that they would use the cave to hang out. I would have imaged that they would probably live there but they did not. And to think that they would say ” Lets go to the Lascaux ?” is kind of funny. Its really cool to see that they would use caves for social event and be part of their culture. I hope humans can maintain these cave so generations to come can visit and learn more about the painting.

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   3. 

      Cindy Le

      September 18, 2016

      I agree with Tina and Vincent. I too believed that many of these ancient people would have chosen to stay and become cave dwellers. Yet, to use these caves as a ceremonial ground is not beyond imagination. Just as we use certain buildings for religious ceremonies or places to celebrate, these ancient people made their mark in the world by leaving art inside of caves. It’s unfortunate that art can be damaged over time.

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   4. 

      Carlos Villicana

      September 18, 2016

      I also found it interesting that humans used caves to hang out. I thought people would actually live in caves and use that as a “home base.” The idea of people back then using it as a hang out area goes to show how human beings have always had very similar desires throughout our existence. I too hope that humans can find a way to preserve the artwork in the caves because without this art, we may have never learned about how humans back then were and what they have contributed to culture to this day.

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8. 

   Nick Lemmerman

   September 16, 2016

   The thing that stands out to me the most from this video is the idea of the Vision Quester appearing all throughout human existence and human culture. The idea of an individual dying in order to be reborn and lead their people is such a powerful story that it’s transcended different primative cultures and made it all the way to the present; it appears in Inuit carvings, African paintings, the story of Christ, and now the Matrix. I comprehend its power and all–I get it–but I ask myself, why is it such a powerful story? Perhaps people need a leader with higher power to guide them? Or maybe, they need comfort in knowing someone will aid them sometime? Go forth and share your opinions! I guess. I will neither stop nor assist you in this.

   Also, the Hall of the Bulls is outstanding to me and I would love to see it in person. It seems massive! I’m baffled at how, and why, they painted all of these paintings.

   –Nick Lemmerman

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   1. 

      andyybui

      September 18, 2016

      Andy Bui

      Hey Nick, I feel that the most outstanding thing from the video is the idea of the Vision Quester. It’s amazing how a general idea such as this can be found in various cultures including ours today. Since it was able to be found in Unuit carvings, African paintings, and the Matrix, there must be some realistic story that it was based off of for all these civilizations to portray this one idea. It makes me wonder where in other civilizations that this can be found also. I was thinking that from the death of the Vision Quester, their struggle and sacrifice to help save their people was realized and a higher power rewarded them for their actions. That’s just how I see it but I wonder how it actually happened back in the day. This story also reminds me of Transformers: Dark of the Moon when Sam the main character was “resurrected” after talking to the Primes and was then rewarded The Matrix.

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9. 

   aleahlomeli28

   September 17, 2016

   Aleah Lomeli

   I think the most interesting thing in this video is the fact that humans are able to die yet be reborn somehow. It not only happened in one place but throughout the world too. Also, I found the Lascaux amazing because it had all different types of art portrayed whether it be animals or handprints. The thing about caves is that each imprint left on the walls has a story behind it which I find amusing and I get curious to know why they did what they did and what was their story behind it. I don’t think art can ever be answered in a simple way, it’s hard to explain why someone did what they did and how the little things have so much meaning. Last, the Hall of the Bulls was fascinating and still went beyond which I would love to see more of!

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   1. 

      Demi Kong

      September 17, 2016

      Hey Aleah! I think the idea of dying and being reborn is so interesting as well! I wonder if this is my first life or even my second, but it could also be my 22nd life. How many times have we walked across this Earth in all of our lives? It is so fascinating and extraordinary to think that we are being reborn as we die. I agree with you in that the art within caves makes you curious. The original artists could have just been drawing to draw, but as humans, we like to think deeper down and develop more intricate ideas. I would like to think that there is an actual story to the pictures and that there was an idea trying to be conveyed. Then again, art is all about perspective so maybe we may never find out the original intent of the cave art.

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   2. 

      Marlene Rodriguez

      September 18, 2016

      Hey Aleah! I agree, I think this part of the video was the most interesting. It’s kind of crazy to think back at each culture and see how different things use to be like. I guess we kind of find it intriguing because doing rituals and being “reborn” isn’t something we normally we do or hear about now a days but back then it was so symbolic and had many different meanings. I’d love to learn more about what each painting, drawing, or carving meant to these people and I’d definitely love to visit historical caves like this one day.

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10. 

    Demi Kong

    September 17, 2016

    In this week’s discussion video, we were introduced to caves. Caves are honestly astonishing because it feels like you are actually stepping into the heart of the earth. There is so much mystery and hidden gems within caves that it definitely takes some work to discover things. Also within some caves may be art. The cave in Lascaux, France had various kinds of art on the walls. The most interesting part of this cave is that there is a picture representing a “man.” Discovered by Marcel Ravidat, this picture is called the “Broken Man.” Cave art hardly depicted human beings, it was usually only animals, shapes, or the outlines of hands so for there to be “man” means that something must have occurred to draw him. When I think of cave art, I think that the pictures are telling a story so perhaps the “man” may have impacted the artists somehow. Also, I think it is incredible that Marcel Ravidat discovered this cave when he was only seventeen! Discovering a cave full of art at such a young age sounds like it could be a plot for a movie or a book. It is absolutely true that age does not matter in art. Anyone can be a part of it and contribute to the field. I wonder if we will discover any more caves to the extent of the Lascaux Cave?

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11. 

    adamshannah96yahoocom

    September 17, 2016

    Hannah Adams posting:
    Early cave art is a subject that has always fascinated me. I was very excited to watch this video. After I finished it though, I found I was left with more questions than answers. There were many things I wanted to research, but I started off by looking up the “Hall of the Bulls”. The bulls depicted are actually an extinct species known as Aurochs. They resemble modern Spanish bulls, but they were larger and could be very aggressive. I find cave paintings not just important to understanding humans, but also the environment around them. Clearly Aurochs were quite prevalent at the time these cave paintings were made. “The Chamber of the Felines” also showed an extinct animal: the cave lion. I find that these paintings important because they act as a snapshot of the fauna of the time period. They show how our environment is changing and how different a world our ancestors inhabited. But I think that cave art is important from not only an environmental standpoint, but a human one as well. Seeing this art I found it raised many questions about people of this time period. It shows that people had free time and it shows what they found important. What is most interesting however, is that there are so few depictions of humans and so many of animals. I would love to know why. It could have been because animals were so important in daily life as a hunter, though Glenn mentioned that the early humans hunted Elk, not bulls. So perhaps there was some kind of religious significance to the piece. Also I would be interested to know which members of a tribe of early people were the ones who made the art. I wounder if it was someone elected to the position of artist, or if it was one of the shamans, or just any member of the tribe? Cave art is just a fascinating topic I could talk a lot about.

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    1. 

       Nhi Truong

       September 17, 2016

       Hey Hannah!
       After watching the video, I also had many questions pop up in my head. I loved how you took the time to research more on the topic. I believe that there were more depictions of animals than of humans because in those days, animals were an important part of life. Animals provided for nearly all the essentials, such as food, weapons, and clothing. I am not entirely sure if I am right or wrong because I am connecting the cave people to Native American tribes, who also honored animals. Many prehistoric cultures that I have studied so far respected the animals so much that animals were to be honored and revered for giving their life so that the tribe may live. However, one thing question that came up in my mind was why the tribes did not paint pictures of reindeers, but instead, they painted bulls. All in all, I agree with your stance that this is a fascinating topic!

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    2. 

       alilovesart

       September 17, 2016

       Definitely agree with you when you said these caves act as a snapshot of human history. I really think if people were to discover more of these caves and be able to understand some of the scriptures on the caves and what some of the paintings actually meant, we would be able to understand better how we evolved as humans, what are great ancestors went through on a daily basis. We would truly be able to understand ourselves better and know exactly what was required of humans thousands of years ago, how they survived, how they had fun, how they ate, etc. I also believe with more and more research in cave art we can even be lead to believe that maybe some of the info we have today in our history books isn’t right.

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12. 

    Nhi Truong

    September 17, 2016

    I really enjoyed this week’s art video because I have always been interested in the cave arts. I guess I’m drawn to the mysteriousness of them. It’s amazing to see how even though these people did not have the same technology as we do today, they still somehow manage to create these massive paintings. I have always thought that people lived in caves because they were a form of shelter that can protect against the elements. However, I was proven wrong when Zucman states that caves were used only for special occasions, such as a vision quest. In the video, Zucman states that the subjects of these paintings were mostly depictions of animals. Now, this creates the question: “How did they choose which animals were important and which animals were not”. The cave in Lascaux had a section called “The Hall of Bulls” in which the entire wall and ceiling were painted with beautiful, variations of bulls. This makes me wonder why bulls were considered as important when reindeers were not. Another important aspect that stood out to me was how different cultures somehow had a character related to “the Broken Man”. It really shows that even though people come from different cultures or from different time periods, all humans are connected through their beliefs and that even though there are different variations, there are some aspects that are the same in all religions. Overall, I found this discussion video very enjoyable.

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    1. 

       Alex Miramontes

       September 17, 2016

       In response to Nhi Truong’s comment, I am also interested by the mystery with cave art. I have so many questions about cave art, yet none of my questions could be answered with certainty. As Zucman mentioned in the video their are different theories associated with Cave art, and we can not be certain of why it was created. “Hall of Bulls” is the only cave art that I am familiar with, and just like you I am curious as to why the people decided to draw bulls instead of different animals. With artist today they draw certain object because it is meaningful to them, and I am curious to why they found bulls interesting enough to draw. The bulls may be associated with the people vision quest, which could have a symbolic meaning to the people. There are so many possibilities as to why they painted what they painted, all we could do is speculate about the cave art.

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13. 

    Alex Miramontes

    September 17, 2016

    This week we discussed about the “AH Timeline” again, but we went into depth about cave art, The Mind in the Cave. There are many different art caves scattered around the world, but the four most popular caves are located in Southern France and Northern Spain named Altimira, Lascaux, Chauvet, and Cosquer. These four caves are karst, which is limestone. Zucman didn’t go into depth about each cave but he did talk about the cave Lascaux, which was discovered by a seventeen year old. What I was fascinated by the most were the theories associated with the art in the caves. Some theorist believed that art caves were used in relationship to their hunting and gathering, but that theory was dismissed. The art in the caves are typically three types: geometric art, hand prints, and animals. I am curious as to why they choose to do art on these things: geometric art, hand prints, and animals. I was also fascinated by how caves were used for spiritual journeys and experiences, they were used as social hubs. The fact that people were drawing intricate art pieces on the walls of caves is fascinated, and they were surrounded by art during their vision quests. Zucman quickly mentioned the “Hall of Bulls” and that is the only cave art that I am familiar with. When I googled the “Hall of Bulls” many questions came across my mind. I became curious about the techniques that the artist used to draw the bulls, who was selected to draw the bulls, and why did the artist draw bulls. I was also fascinated by “the broken man” because the drawing seems to be universal across time and culture. Its interesting how the broken man appears in different cultures and time, it shows how different cultures share similar experiences.

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    1. 

       moniquealcala

       September 18, 2016

       Monique Alcala

       Hello Alex!

       I agree with you on your fascination behind many of the points you touched upon such as the social gatherings theory and “The Broken Man”. I did further research on the actual paintings in the caves and found that the pigments used to paint Lascaux and other caves were from readily available minerals. They did not find brushes in the caves so their theory is that they used mats of moss or hair as well as the broken twigs and bones that Zucman mentioned in the video. They also found several bone fragments which were covered in paint which suggests they also used the reindeer’s skeletal remains to paint their paintings. I also did further research and became extremely interested in the “Hall of Bulls” cave. The artwork is truly impeccable and paintings were far beyond their time. It’s also amazing analyzing their drawings due to the lack of brushes that they had. Another fact I thought that was interesting was that the paintings are a collection of artwork from different artists from different periods. I thought that all of the artwork was drawn/painted at the same time by possibly a group of artists.

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    2. 

       maritessanne

       September 18, 2016

       Maritess Inieto

       Hey Alex!

       It’s cool how the popular art caves are located at Europe and that there are many around the world. This makes me think, “Are there still many other caves that have yet to be discovered?” Not only that, but I wonder how many caves also weren’t able to make it out today, like if some caves had eroded or collapsed and the art of that time and those people were never taken account of in art history. Isn’t it crazy how a 17 year-old discovered the Lascaux Cave? Whereas I’m over here, 20 years-old, not yet discovering anything. The theories also intrigued me. Because the people who discovered these caves were not from the time period of the people who decorated these caves, who knows what the true meanings are behind these paintings. Because these caves were sometimes used as social hubs, I feel like these art caves were like the bars for people back in the day. I was also curious about the techniques used to draw bulls for the “Hall of Bulls”! I was interested altogether in how people back then created pigments to make all these drawings with. Not only that, but how these pigments were able to stay in tact to this day. The broken man really makes one wonder about what it symbolized among all these different cultures and times. What did it mean for people in Europe versus people in Africa? So many questions to ask over one symbol.

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    3. 

       Christian Gallo

       September 18, 2016

       Hey Alex,
       I agree that the Hall of Bulls does bring up a lot of questions in mind. For example why did they choose to draw the bulls and what kind of significance do they have.These drawing were nicely drawn and I am surprise on how long they lasted. These art work were well preserve since they were able to last this long.

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14. 

    Raylyn Diep

    September 17, 2016

    Raylyn Diep
    The Mind in the cave is really interesting. It is amazing how these cave art were able to survive to this day. It really tells a story and shows us what was happening 16,000 years ago in Lascaux, France. I wonder what kind of people made these interesting cave art. I would love to know what they were thinking as they drew this. These cave arts really show us the culture and religious belief these people had. It was interesting to learn to there are people who are called Vision Questers who seek out an animal spirit just to be able to come back as a Shaman to help their people. The Broken Man seemed a little creepy at first to me as I imagine a human figure with a human head. However, it was gives the idea of the traditions and beliefs of the earliest periods. I shows the shamanic elements talked in this video. These people who drew these pictures must be in an altered state of consciousness. Overall, these cave arts are really amazing and it makes people think about the stories behind them. I would definitely like to go see these caves myself if I were to ever get the chance.

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    1. 

       Daniel Velazquez

       September 17, 2016

       Hey Raylyn,
       I agree with your thoughts on this topic. These drawings are in a place where we would not imagine them to be. It is interesting to see why they decided to draw them in a cave, maybe because they would last this long? These drawing do show some of the beliefs people had and how some of those beliefs have changed or lived out through time. Just as you would like to go see these drawing, I would also like to go these drawing some day.

       Daniel Velazquez

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15. 

    Daniel Velazquez

    September 17, 2016

    Art can truly be anywhere in the world and can be made out of anything. Art in a cave sounds weird and did not sound like art when I first heard. People show emotions through art. In hall of the bulls they did not draw the animals they ate. They only had pictures of animals that seemed to be useful or valuable such as horses. Deer meat was what they ate even though this is also important to them they were not drawn in the caves. This is all interesting and makes me wish I could have been there when theses drawings were first made to see the true meaning of the drawings.

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16. 

    alilovesart

    September 17, 2016

    Wow, this video was extremely interesting. I love the way it was broken down, it really fascinated my how most or alot of ancient art can be found in caves, which makes a lot of scene because perhaps that was a good source of shelter back then and suitable to create art, im rather impressed to how well the southern France and Italy have preserved the caves to reveal the art that was created thousands of years ago to better understand humanity and history and art. What i though was really cool was when that Ravidat, actually climbed down the shaft, and came back up very pale and nauseous, Its almost as though that part of the cave was meant for humans to precieve art on a altered state of consciousness. I though the Hall of bulls was really cool too, I thought the level of quality art was almost ahead of its time considering it was painted thousands of years ago, because it looked really detailed and well painted. Crazier then all that these caves were used as social gathering places where everyone came to this sheltered place and did what they did. Would really like to visit these caves one day, for someone to see what humans were doing thousands of years ago is extremely fascinating to me.

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    1. 

       johncrewsavage

       September 18, 2016

       John Savage (1pm)

       Hi alilovesart,
       I am also very impressed of how well the art in the caves has been preserved. The fact that art that is 16,000 years old can survive this long is unbelievable. I like that both France and Spain have taken measures to help preserve the art from another time. With them being so well preserved, one day I too would like to visit these caves and see the Hall of Bulls and the other paintings in person.

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17. 

    moniquealcala

    September 17, 2016

    Monique Alcala

    This week I found myself truly engaged in the video and wanting to know more. I had a very narrow-minded view on what cave paintings were about as far as where they were located and the images that were painted inside of them. I was intrigued to find that some were located in Spain and France. They drew handprints and geometric sequences, and the animals that they drew on the caves were not the animals they hunted. This was made known since the remains of reindeer were found in these caves. I thought the sole purpose of the Lascaux caves were to serve as homes but after this video I learned that they were used as a place of gathering and celebration. These paintings are also located deep in the caves and inside chambers that are not easily located which supports the theory that the caves were used for sacred gatherings. It’s interesting to see that Neanderthals felt the need to decorate their scared gathering spot and that they wanted to share the art with people who were of good acquaintances. From the beginning of time, art has been a topic that has brought people together and has been a passion for us. Although we do not exactly know the reason behind the paintings, one can assume that the art was discussed amongst and used as a topic to bond over which I would have never assumed to be true because of how primitive these people were.

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    1. 

       Marysol Jimenez

       September 18, 2016

       Hey Monique!
       I totally agree with you, before this video and before doing research about the caves I also believed that the caves were used as homes. This is to show how uneducated we are about other cultures and history. I found it very interesting how they actually used the caves to socialize and for cultural events and rituals. Just to think how far back art has made a difference in people’s lives is astonishing. Like we have said before, art is everywhere and it will continue to be as long as humans can express themselves.

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    2. 

       Ana Maya

       September 18, 2016

       Hi Monique! I agree with your comment. I, too, was very narrow-minded about what caves were used for thousands of years ago. I thought people used them only as shelter to hide away from predators. However, after watching this video I am intrigued to research more about the paintings found there and what stories/meanings can be derived from them.

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18. 

    Roxana Chavez

    September 18, 2016

    Hi alilovesart,
    I can’t agree with you any more on how fascinating the quality of art the bulls are. Its amazing to se how past generations created their very own materials from what they had around them. I keep asking myself questions on how they did it all.How did they create materials that would keep these paintings in the caves still visible after many years. And still visible and very detailed. Its amazing that people to this day can still get a glimpse of the amazing art still being displayed in these caves today. And who knows maybe there is many more caves with drawings still yet undiscovered! The world is filled with wonders.

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19. 

    Selena Lara

    September 18, 2016

    Selena Lara

    Personally, I didn’t think that decorative caves existed; to me they sound like something out of a Disney movie. The fact that they are real is really fascinating. All my ideas about what caves were completely changed. When I thought about caves I always thought they were someone’s homes not where rituals took place. The Mind in the Cave illuminated how cultures across the globe are connected. It was interesting how the same reoccurring image of the broken man was found across time essentially around the world. Even the U.S, has the same image of the broken man through the movie the Matrix. What also stood out to me was how this community that went through these vision quest at the time. Speaking from our point in time they essentially didn’t really know what they were going through. They didn’t understand that their minds were being altered because of the natural shaft of carbon dioxide. Being and individual that is completely fascinated by science, its interesting to see what people can go through because of the lack of discovery. For example, things like what is carbon dioxide and how that affects the mind. At the same, if these people knew would we be provided with the same cave paintings and fascinating history? To me this video brought up more questions than answers.

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    1. 

       Briana G

       September 18, 2016

       Selena, i have to agree with you. Cave art was something I saw in movies and heard about but never actually seen or took the time to look up. I was surprised to see that it actually existed. It’s important to note that if it wasn’t for people like the seventeen year old that discovered Lascaux, we wouldn’t be able to learn about this form of art which has become a part of modern art as Glen mentioned in the video. I think it was pretty cool to see it and learn about it a bit more.

       Briana Garcia 1pm

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20. 

    maritessanne

    September 18, 2016

    Maritess Inieto

    Upper Paleolithic—Cave Art
    The moment “cave art” was introduced, my attention was already caught. In my head, I instantly thought, these are the world’s first posters and wallpaper. There are a lot more decorated caves than I thought. It’s crazy how a 17 year-old was just venturing out with his friends when he found one of these decorated caves. They went out for an adventure, but ended up finding some art history. Some of these caves, like the Lascaux Cave, were built very complexly. In my mind I imagined just giant holes in mountains with drawings inside, but this cave in particular had little extra passage ways of art aside from just one big cave full of drawings. I’m interested in how they created pigments back in the day. I know there are many different types, depending on where the caves are located. I wonder how they put a few resources together and realized, hey, we can draw using this. It is also fascinating how people way back when, were able to paint so high up in these caves. I can’t imagine ladders being extremely dependable back in the day, but who knows. The Broken Man aroused my curiosity because it was made in Western Europe but later popped up in other art pieces. It made me ask a lot of questions like, what does this “Broken Man” mean to all these people? What gave them the idea to paint this “Broken Man”? and so on. It is such a mystery. After all this time, what caught my interest the most was, after all this time, some of these caves were still preserved. I feel like cave art really connects humans to nature.

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    1. 

       nataliesantanablog

       September 18, 2016

       Natalie Santana

       Hey Maritess,
       I thought your post was very interesting. When I heard cave art was this weeks art talk I immediately thought of history class when we would talk about caves and the paintings that have been found in some caves. I always thought that the caves were where they lived but it amazed my when the professor explained how it wasn’t their home but it was more of a place where special occasions occurred. It also got me thinking, who was allowed to carve paintings in these caves, was anyone allowed or only a few people. I loved how hand prints were found in the caves and I thought it was the people leaving a mark of themselves. I also only thought that these caves were small but now I realized that they are more complex than I thought. It was great how you brought up that you are interested in how they pigments back in the day, that’s something that we should research. I was also fascinated by the fact that there were paintings on the ceilings and wondered to myself how they got up there. It’s great how art from so long ago is still connected to today.

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21. 

    lozano1021

    September 18, 2016

    Araceli Lozano

    The Lascaux Cave in France was discovered in September 12, 1940 by a Marcel, Georges, Simon, Jacques, and their dog Robot. The cave was opened to the public in 1948 after the war was over. Simon and Jacque were the first tour guides and had been watching over the cave throughout the Nazi invasion of France. It was later closed in 1963 due to the artificial lights fading the vivid colors of the paintings. Also, algae began to grow because people were bringing it in on the bottom of their shoes. In 1983 a replica of the Lascaux cave was opened and tens of thousands of people visit annually.
    It’s amazing how well the artwork had been preserved for thousands of years. The artworks are captivating and intriguing. Scientist believe that it was passed down to generations because all the paintings were dated different times.
    It’s interesting that there were no other figures resembling humans other than the figure with the bird head. I wonder why that is. It’s always amazing to discover new things about the past and I definitely was unaware of this cave until today.

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22. 

    Christian Gallo

    September 18, 2016

    Christian Gallo
    This video was interesting and brought many questions to mind. For example the video mentions that they did not draw animals that they ate. Is there a reason for that? Why did the choose to draw in a cave since they did not live in them, was it to leave a mark in history? I am surprise on how some of the animals are well drawn and on how they had different colors. It is amazing that they were able to make large art work. I would like to visit some of these caves and see the art work in person.

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23. 

    samueldelacruzblog

    September 18, 2016

    Samuel De La Cruz

    I have always found cave art to be interesting because it is a way to go back in time to see how life was back then. This video was also interesting because it gave some history to the Lascaux cave and others in the regions of southern France and northern Spain. The Lascaux cave was discovered by Marcel Ravidat in 1940 at the age of 17 years old when he was out exploring the area with his friends. Lascaux cave is sixteen-thousand years old and it is a cave with multiple chambers in it. There is the Hall of Bulls that only has bulls painted on the walls and it has the Axial Gallery right after the Hall of Bulls. Further to the right passage of the cave there is The Shaft area that has a drop off that is hard to get into. In this drop off Marcel found a picture on the wall of a humanistic figure with the head of a bird and bird talons as its hands. What makes this picture stand out is that throughout the whole cave there is paintings of hands, bulls, and other weird objects but no humans on the walls. This painting is a depiction of a broken man that is not human that has an erection. It is said to be a depiction of a vision quest-er that dies and is then reborn, merged with the spirit guide, as a shaman for the people. What I find more interesting is that this figure is found around the world and through time it emerges over and over again. This figure has also been found in Inuit carvings and in southern African paintings around the world. Even in modern times this depiction has been used in the modern era film of The Matrix. This shows that humans even in ancient times were interested in art to gather people together in order to share a common interest.

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24. 

    Briana Garcia

    September 18, 2016

    Briana Garcia 1pm

    If I’m being completely honest, I never really thought stuff like cave art existed. I always assumed it was a myth until I saw the video. It was interesting to see how art started years and years ago. While watching the video I kept wondering how people back then came up with the idea to paint on the walls of caves. I did some research and it turns out the cave art started as outlines and later become complete, colorful paintings of animals. According to my research, the exact purpose of cave art is unknown but I assume it was a way of communication back then. Who knew that cave art would evolve all over the world and eventually be tied into modern art or ideas of today, such as The Matrix like Glenn mentioned in the video. I think this video definitely caught my attention and increased my interest in learning more about how art began, the different forms of art and how it can relate to art today. According to a website that discusses the cave of Lascaux, they were able to conclude that paintings such as the Hall of Bulls was created at different times by different people. This adds on to my theory of cave art being a form of communication. It’s interesting to see how people were able to share something in common like this.

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    1. 

       monicalock

       September 18, 2016

       Hi Briana!
       I thought it was funny when you mentioned that you didn’t know cave art existed prior to this video, but I realized I didn’t know much either. Prior to watching this introductory video, I only had a small sense of cave art, and I didn’t bother researching further about its’ origin and purpose. After reading your post, I learned that it started as outlines and eventually turned into more complex images. I also learned that the main purpose was to communicate. I originally thought cave art was used as a way to express themselves rather than trying to communicate to one another. I think you made a really good point about it being a form of communication. It reminded me back in high school when I had to check out textbooks from the school. I can recall receiving my textbook for my AP U.S. history class and I started to skim through the pages. One page stood out to me because there was so much vandalism on it. I was reading the comments and students from different years were communicating.

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       1. 

          monicalock

          September 18, 2016

          ^^Monica Lock, 1pm

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    2. 

       esmerized

       September 18, 2016

       Hey Briana!

       First off I like how you were completely honest in your post, I thought it was funny because I think about these things too like how people even came up with ideas on painting in such things as caves. And I like how you wanted answers to these questions and went to go do your own research and really made me think what was the real purpose of cave art and mind blowing that we will never know the real answer. Every idea you put on this post ran through my head and that’s the most interesting part but I totally agree with you and your thoughts.

       -Esmeray Lopez (1PM)

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25. 

    johncrewsavage

    September 18, 2016

    John Savage (1pm)

    I have always seen small cave art paintings throughout school but I have never seen the full Hall of Bulls painting at Lascaux. The full painting was absolutely amazing and had me in awe. The fact that people 16,000 years ago could do such amazing work is astounding. The most interesting part of the whole video however was the part about The Broken Man. The thing that I found interesting about The Broken Man was the fact that the same depiction of a person is found in other parts of the world and in different cultures. Each culture’s rendition of The Broken Man has a slightly different look to them but still had the the core image of the painting. The most amazing thing about cave art is that it shows us that the human race always wanted to create and express ideas through their art.

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26. 

    samueldelacruzblog

    September 18, 2016

    Samuel De La Cruz

    I agree with you John Savage that it is amazing how people from different parts of the world had the same broken man image. Even though the images are not identical they are similar enough to be connected and considered to be the same. The human mind is amazing and evidence has shown that we either follow each others thoughts or different regions tap into the same ideas without even knowing about each other. This can be seen around the world with ancient cultures that did not have contact but there are pyramids around the world. In Egypt, Americas, and Asia there have been pyramids found from ancient cultures.

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27. 

    Vincent Santos

    September 18, 2016

    The cave discution was very interesting, I personally was not aware caves like this were around. They seem like a nice place to see at least once in your life. They is so much to take from these caves, like the vision quest, and how they thought the world would turn out to be. I found it weird how they painted animals but did not paint bout rain dears which they ate. And then i started thinking maybe they painted animals that would also hunt dears. It crazy how a seventeen year old discovered this cave climbing down the rope was brave and I would not have imaged myself doing something like that.I one day wish to visit a cave and see how it really looks like in person and how big the caves were built.

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28. 

    Cindy Le

    September 18, 2016

    Cave art is very fascinating to me, despite only ever seeing it in person twice. Once during one of my trips to Vietnam, the other was a replica of one in a museum. Books have also given me a chance to learn about aspects of certain cave arts. From what I’ve learned, pictures in caves would depict like these great events, or tell of stories about the people who painted them. The pictures/paintings were amazing itself. I can only imagine how these people, with no modern technology or what so ever, are able to paint on the high ceilings. I hope to one day, travel to extraordinary caves like these and see the art for myself.

    Stories are told and rewritten constantly. I believe that the ideas we have today, originate from ideas that appeared long ago. And because stories weren’t written down until much later, the people who told the stories would change certain aspects to accommodate the lesson they probably were trying to teach for the most part. This is very similar to the “broken man” in the cave art, where different versions are found in different cultures, only tweaked so that it would fit their beliefs. These people must have gotten inspiration from those around them while they traveled, just as we get inspiration from many different cultures that influence our way of living and interests as well.

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29. 

    monicalock

    September 18, 2016

    The Mind in the Cave talks about decorated caves primarily in Southern France and Northern Spain. Marcel Ravidat, a 17 year old boy first discovered a cave in Lascaux, France in 1940. As Professor Zucman describes the scene where Ravidat was exploring the caves with his friends, I immediately thought of the Goonies. In the movie, unlike the ladder Ravidat used to climb down, a group of young boys slid down a slide and entered a cave. The boys explored and found a ship with hidden treasures such as jewelry, while Ravidat found hidden artwork such as The Broken Man.
    Three different types of artwork mentioned when it comes to cave art are hand prints, geometric art, and animals which, to me, seem ordinary and typical forms of art. The point that stood out to me the most was the bird-like creature with a broken neck. It stood out to me because he said how that similar artwork such as the broken man appears across human time and culture. It appeared in 1940, where Ravidat was exploring the cave. Similarly it appeared again in South Africa, and later in The Matrix. This recurring image of a broken man shows how art has transformed over the years, yet resembles over many different cultures. It is highly unlikely for the artist from South Africa to travel to Lascaux, France and have seen the painting.

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    1. 

       monicalock

       September 18, 2016

       ^^ Monica Lock, 1pm

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30. 

    allison cruz

    September 18, 2016

    I thought this video discussion was very interesting because of how important these cave art discoveries are and how it give insight to a culture or community of people who created it. I can see today’s “cave art” being instagram and how different people put up different pictures of themselves, what they like to eat or things about them that they want the world to know. It is so amazing to me how a simple cave art drawing can offer so much and how what they did or did not draw can tell us about them and how that translates from culture to culture over so many years. Cave art tell us that humans were very innovative through progression of their work and the use of materials. I looked up Hall of the Bulls and was amazed by the scale, use of perspective, and how the simple paintings appear to be in motion which only exemplifies cave artist’s skills at the time.

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    1. 

       amysongblog

       September 18, 2016

       Hi Allison! I liked how you compared the cave paintings to Instagram. It never occurred to me that we can look at it that way. I agree that these seemingly simple paintings can offer so much information about the people that made them. But I also think there’s still so many mysteries about their life that we don’t know and I think that’s really cool!

       Amy Song

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    2. 

       Evan Burton

       September 18, 2016

       Allison,
       I agree that humans have always been very innovative and have always progressed upwards in their outlets of creation. I also think that art was even more vital to those that lived thousands of years ago. While tribal people had to deal with hardships that are nearly nonexistent to living people today, art was one of the only ways in which they could add something meaningful to this crazy world. It probably helped them rationalize their lives, seeing their struggles and triumphs depicted on a cave wall that would last a very long time. Automatically, most people would just assume that primitive people were actually primitive, not capable of the emotions and self-awareness that we experience. But through the grand pieces of art in these Lascaux caverns, I realize that those tribesmen and women were also homo sapiens that felt the same inward-looking questions we all feel periodically. Their way to express these feelings was through art, storytelling, and the relationships they had. You can see this in their artwork, which focuses on the people and their journeys, not on singular kings or omnipotent deities. Their culture revolved around the well-being of each other, as shown in Lascaux, France.

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31. 

    andyybui

    September 18, 2016

    Andy Bui

    It’s crazy to imagine that even before people way before us in the “prehistory” era were involved in elaborate art pieces. Professor Zuccman said that since we were nomadic, we could either have art to be portable or to be in caves. I think the choice made for the art to be in caves was a smart one. The art displayed in caves can be similar to how we display art in museums today; it is one big gathering place for the community to see our works of art. One thing I can’t really believe is that Professor Zuccman has been diving in subterranean caves in Floria and the Yucatan Peninsula, it sounds like he has a more exciting life than many of us. Also, it’s pretty cool how a seventeen year old can uncover the “single greatest discovery in the history of art”. The only thing I discover is that I’m bad at studying. On a more serious note, the art in the cave’s Hall of the Bulls was amazing. For being a civilization so undeveloped, they were able to accomplish so much and be so inventive, especially since there was evidence of scaffolding which allowed them to paint the thirteen foot tall paintings. Another cool aspect of the cave was the Axial Gallery where the drawings were on the ceiling like the Sistine Chapel. I feel that the most interesting part of the video was when Professor talked about the Vision Quester drawings in The Shaft being relatable to The Matrix. This part was most interesting because I feel that if you’re able to relate older ideas to ideas from the present, it is able to keep us intrigued.

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32. 

    irepbrian

    September 18, 2016

    Brian Sath

    First off, I think the time line is very organized. Overall, I felt that the video was interesting. I never really thought about other various forms of art and how interesting it could be. I believe that the caves that are located near Southern France and Northern Spain are just significant overall for the history of art. I believe that this encourages more people to travel, however, I actually have never heard of these cave sites in any readings growing up. I do agree that it is crazy that a 17-year-old Marcel Ravidat was able to discover the Lascaux cave. It just makes him seem like the very adventurous type, and makes me seem like I have not accomplished anything. It is astonishing that the cave wasn’t discovered until 1940.

    The Lascaux cave is overall very beautiful, with the Hall of the Bulls being the most beautiful. It just seems so majestic to have the artwork with a decent amount of lighting. It surprises me that this artwork was created so long ago and it’s still here, and they had the time to actually go into a cave for a special occasion and create artwork. It makes you curious as to what inspired them and what made them go into a dark cave. For me, maybe they were hibernating and were bored, but I’m really not too sure. Along with that, I feel like the bird man is a very symbolic figure as it appears throughout time. I knew that it was familiar, however, I did not expect it to be found in other time periods. This surprised me and is intriguing. I can’t wait for more videos!

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    1. 

       kayaquarles

       September 18, 2016

       Hi Brian!
       I seem to agree with a lot of your thoughts. Marcel Ravidat ventured into a cave and discovered the Lascaux cave, that is crazy! I can’t even imagine adventuring out like that. When I think of art, I tend to think about paintings and drawings on canvas etc, but it didn’t occur to me that art could be found in caves as well. I also think that the Hall of Bulls was the most intricate. It seems to have been done on such a large scale, I wonder how long it took for them to finish it. I’m not sure if I agree that they were bored and hibernating but it is a possibility! I think that they were trying to tell a story. But no matter what it is still very interesting.

       Kaya Quarles

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33. 

    Marlene Rodriguez

    September 18, 2016

    I found this weeks art talk really interesting just because of all the history behind it. To be honest I never would have found myself being so fascinated with these awesome caves. I think my biggest dream is to visit a tropical island that has caves like this and actually get the chance to go inside them. The idea that people were actually in those exact caves where people now step foot in is crazy and I don’t know why but kind of creepy. I began to look more into the Lascaux cave and just thought it was amazing that they did they made these drawings of animals that were so special to their country and culture. The part that scared me was the fact that they had a cave filled with mostly carbon dioxide which made the people inside the cave having their “celebration” become more imaginative and create their paintings with much detail. Also the drawing Marcel found in the gave was bit strange to have a human figure with an animal head. I really am curious as to know their exact thoughts and feelings as they created these pieces.

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    1. 

       Andrew Nguyen

       September 18, 2016

       Hi Marlene,
       I definitely agree with your assertions this weeks art discussion did have a lot of historical significance behind it. I was very interested in the Lascaux caves because I thought it was really interesting how a young boy was able to discover it. I also thought it was odd that the cave was filled with carbon dioxide. I am also curious what Marcel thought about the pieces when he stumbled upon them. Thank you for sharing Marlene!

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34. 

    kayaquarles

    September 18, 2016

    Kaya Quarles

    When I first found out that this video was going to be about different caves around the world, I was intrigued because I hadn’t realized how intricate these artistic caves could be. The caves were created as the surface water eroded away the limestone. These caves were particularly dangerous because as you go further and further into them, you are exposed to more and more carbon dioxide, which isn’t healthy for humans to intake in large quantities. There has been speculation as to what went on in the cave but no one will ever know what truly occurred in them. I looked up “Hall of Bulls” and was shocked by how intricate it was. Most of the cave art seemed to be animals and the only form of human had a birds head, I wonder why? The art pieces seem so big and that’s from the pictures! I’d love to see some of these in person.

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35. 

    amysongblog

    September 18, 2016

    Amy Song

    I was really surprised by how large and long these caves are, and that there are more than one cave in that area. There are many speculations as to what these caves were used for, many of them suggest it was for spiritual events. It was really interesting to learn that there are large amounts of carbon dioxide in the caves and it could have contributed to the old spiritual things that could have happened in the caves. One thin that caught my attention was that the animals painted in the caves were not the animals they ate, which were reindeers. Maybe the animals that were painted were sacred to the people. I also thought it was really interesting that the man/bird figure was seen in other paintings of different continents and that the symbol of a guide permeates in modern society.

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    1. 

       Linda Nguyen

       September 18, 2016

       Hi Amy,
       I agree with your idea that the painted animals were sacred to the people who drew them seeing as they ate reindeer at the time. Perhaps they idolized certain animals like some religions couture to do today? It’s amazing how we are able to see parallels between these cave paintings and religion. The motion of the carbon dioxide contributing to old spiritual rituals happening in the cave reminded me of greek mythology back in high school where the hero would go to the oracle for his quest. The oracle lived on a volcanic island, so she too was exposed to high amounts of gas so theres another parallel between how gases were used in rituals in the past.

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       1. 

          Linda Nguyen

          September 18, 2016

          *cultures (not couture) and *mention (not motion)

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    2. 

       duhmarkymark

       September 18, 2016

       Marcelo Ceballos Jr. – 1pm

       Hey Amy, I like your point about them painting animals that they were not eating. I really makes you wonder why they would even spend the time to paint them. What kind of non food value did these beasts bring to these people. Today people have to have an incentive to do anything, but it seems like these people were painting just for the enjoyment it brought them and the beauty that it brought into their lives. I hope that the art created today will be able to stand the test of time and be preserved for generations to come, and hopefully they can wonder why we created what we did.

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36. 

    beentiredblog

    September 18, 2016

    Initially when I realized this video was about an actual cave, I was like, “what does a cave have to do with art?” But this video was really interesting. What I first noticed about the examples of the types of art displayed inside the cave were the colors. The earthy red, brown, and off-white colors looked so beautifully uniform. It really makes me wonder about the people who actually painted all that was in the cave. Did they live inside the caves? Were the caves only used for ritual purposes? Were the artists both male and female? Also, it’s crazy to me that this cave wa discovered so recently than I would have imagined. I figured by 1940 a lot of the unknown of our early ancestors was coming to light and would have been discovered much early on the that century. What the drawings seem to display can imply a lot of the people as far as what they thought were important to them. It’s also mind blowing at how smart these artists were as far as the locations of these drawings and creativity displayed. Also, for drawings seen on ceilings of these 13 foot walls, how in the world would they get to the ceiling and remain there to draw and paint the art found on them? Again, this shows the innovative and creative thinking of these early natives to Lascaux, France. It’s awesome.

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37. 

    beentiredblog

    September 18, 2016

    ^^^^ Kayla Tafoya-Sablan

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38. 

    juanfvasquez

    September 18, 2016

    Juan Vasquez (1pm)

    I was definitely surprised on the quality of the work granted that it was created over 16,000 years ago. The different colors they were able to make surprises me the most as a lot of the work has remained intact over time. I also find it to be interesting that it has been shown that the work was done by different generations as well. The fact that all the work is still intact is what amazes me the most about cave art as well as that there were not images of human figures. Did the artists not find human beings interesting enough to draw? I wonder why the connection of death and rebirth is found in several different locations around the world. It made me think of the “resurrection” of Jesus Christ and how it is very similar to the depictions of spiritual beings.

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    1. 

       jackiesanchezart110

       September 18, 2016

       Hello Juan,

       I definitely see how the image of the broken figure made you the draw the connection with Christ and religion; I see the same connection myself. I think it is very interesting to think that maybe the figure of the broken man was a “religious” figure to the people of that time and that throughout history this figure has just evolved and been appropriated into the modern religious figures we see today.

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39. 

    Marysol Jimenez

    September 18, 2016

    This weeks discussion was about ” The Mind in the Cave.” Professor Zucman introduced a few caves which were located in Southern France and Northern Spain named Altimira, Lascaux, Chauvet, and Cosquer. The cave that was discussed more in depth was Lascaux, which was discovered on September 12,1940 by a seventeen year old boy named Marcel Ravidat.This means the cave was discovered about seventy-six years ago! The paintings in the walls of the cave were mostly bulls. Some people say the paintings were in relation to hunting, maybe hey would map out their hunting plans? Others believe that it has a connection with constellations and the zodiac sign Taurus. This theory was interesting to me because I myself am a Taurus and am curious to know what exactly were they trying to portray with the paintings in relation to the zodiac sign. There are many theories out there for the existence of the paintings but we may never have the real answer to them, its up to our own mind to believe the theories. It is amazing to me how the paintings still exist and have not all the way deteriorated although i did read that even a human breathe can ruin the paintings due to so many years of existence. Another fact i learned was that people did not actually live in the caves, it was not their home but the place to unite and socialize.

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40. 

    jackiesanchezart110

    September 18, 2016

    Jacqueline Sanchez 1P.M

    The video “The Mind in the Cave” discusses the ancient cave paintings that were discovered in Lascaux, France in 1940. I first learned about the Lascaux cave paintings in my high school art history class and have always found them to be very interesting. To me, they are significant because they mark the beginning of sophisticated paintings for the sheer purpose of art. In the video professor Zucman explains that people of that time ate reindeer and not bulls. Therefore, we can infer that these paintings were much more than simple educational paintings on about how to hunt or what to eat. To the people that painted them, the imagery of the the bulls had a deeper meaning and the fact that they did not live in the caves further emphasizes the idea that these paintings didn’t just hold some simple practical purpose. Another thing that was mentioned in the video is the figure of the broken man. Professor Zucman states that imagery of broken men is found throughout many time periods and cultures. One can even argue that modern religious figures, like Christ, Mohammed, Buddha, etc., are all just appropriated evolutions of ancient figures such as the one found in the Lascaux cave paintings. It is fascinating to think that maybe these cave paintings symbolize some early form of, or even the roots, of religion.

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41. 

    Evan Burton

    September 18, 2016

    I was very interested in the concept of the Vision Quest as stated by Professor Zucman about halfway through the video. His narration depicted a possible “Vision Quest” that involved a member of the tribe or community joining spiritual forces with an animal entity for the good of the entire group. The Hall of the Bulls discussion went into this in further detail, and made me consider how the culture of these ancient painters is reflected in what they painted. Since the Lascaux Cave dates back to approximately 16,000 years ago, the culture of the tribesmen and women lies on the opposite side of the spectrum from our current values. Modern countries and societies value competition over cooperation, focusing on the domination of external environments instead of cohabitating with it. This is the difference between the European settlers and the American Indians, a contrast so extreme that only one group could live on the land. Individual success and ownership of property are the priorities of today’s world. The Vision Quest concept showcases the opposite mindset, with a communal focus on the well-being of the whole. An altruistic man goes on a journey to better his tribe by sacrificing his individuality. This action is only praised in a cooperation-based society, and is also reflected in the art of its time. The Hall of the Bulls paintings, and most tribal cave paintings as well, depict numerous individuals or animals because their societies respect the environment as an equal. Unlike ours, cooperation-based societies do not attempt to dominate and shape the landscape, which is a mindset we can so easily forget exists until we watch a video like this one.

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42. 

    esmerized

    September 18, 2016

    Esmeray Lopez (1PM)

    This week’s video on “The Mind in the Cave” was actually really interesting! And I learned so much that I never really took into consideration that art in caves could be so fascinating. It totally blew my mind that Marcel Ravidat discovered the Lascaux cave at just 17 years old, we could never do something that cool even if we tried. The Hall of Bulls is very particular in how most of the art work is on the ceiling and it just had me in deep thought of how these people were even able to get up there and paint such things. The biggest thing that blew my mind about this entire video was the Carbon Monoxide that would cause people to go into an altered state of mind. Overall this was a very cool video to watch and made me much more aware of cave art in the world and even drew my curiosity to go explore one some day.

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    1. 

       jonathangirgis

       September 18, 2016

       Jonathan Girgis (1 pm):

       It would be awesome to find something like this! It’s weird how some of the first humans ever to exist took time to actually draw and paint the art they made in caves. It makes me wonder what they were thinking while they were doing it: what was the reason? What were they trying to express? What inspired them to do so? I never thought much of cave art prior but now my perspective on it has certainly changed. In every region of the world across different time, people made art for themselves and for others, and I am lucky to experience it all.

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    2. 

       yonathansahle

       September 18, 2016

       Yonathan Sahle

       Yea i agree with you this video opened my eyes to Cave art, i never knew that it existed. Learning about the Hall of the Bulls was great to know. You make a great point with the carbon monoxide, its crazy how that would cause people to change into an altered state of mind, and even make them want to draw the images they drew. It also blew my mind when i heard that Marcel was only 17 when he discovered the Cave art in France. At 17 it must of been a life changing event for him to experience that kind of art with his friends. I too hope that i will get to experience cave art and see it for myself one day like Marcel did.

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43. 

    yonathansahle

    September 18, 2016

    Yonathan Sahle

    The Mind in a Cave was a pretty cool thing to learn about. I never knew that there was art in caves. I honestly thought that the art that was going to be shared were limestones, the layers of old rocks over time being exposed in caves. That was my initial thought when i heard of The Mind in a Cave. I really found the detailed explanation of what lies in the cave pretty interesting. The drawings of the animals and the art of the human and animal hybrid was pretty interesting to see, at the same time it was kind of weird to think about. Its weird because they never drew humans but rather different looking animals, and the fact that some of them were dead makes me wonder what were thinking about. What made them want to draw those images and what was there plan? When taking this class i honestly thought that we were going to stick to paint, drawing, and maybe some photography, I didn’t expect to get into learning about art that was done in a cave. This video was pretty amazing to watch and see how organized the timeline is. Hopefully they still do tours of these Caves because i think it would be interesting to see it in person.

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44. 

    jonathangirgis

    September 18, 2016

    Jonathan Girgis (1pm)

    It is amazing to see that even at the very beginning, we human beings made art as one of the first things we ever produced. It really is in our DNA it seems. I absolutely loved the Hall of Bulls- it would be amazing to see it in person. The artwork there is incredible, and being made from someone who did not have much to build upon prior further attests to that. The artwork at the Hall of Bulls would feel like it wants to swallow you in as you’re surrounded by it and since you’d be close to it as well. I wonder what it would be like being a 17 year old who stumbles upon a mysterious cave- something the movies would happily show, I’m sure. And the Shaft with the high levels of CO2 is creepy and enticing as well- to say the least, I would like to tour this cave if I ever go to France! The things you can learn and see from our past is simply great.

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45. 

    nataliesantanablog

    September 18, 2016

    Natalie Santana

    I thought this weeks Art Talk was fascinating. I learned about caves in high school history class but I always assumed that the caves were their homes but these caves in France were used for special occasions and rituals. I didn’t think that cave art existed and it was cool learning about it this week. It amazed me how large and long the caves are that they have to spit them in sections. I love how they had a lot of hand prints in the caves so they were kind of leaving a mark of themselves in there. I thought it was also really cool how one of the galleries had all of the paintings on the ceiling. I wonder how they painted on the ceiling. It’s crazy how this art was created so long ago, yet it can tell us so much about them and the art can be interrupted in many different ways just like art today. What caught my attention was the figure of the broken man and that figure occurs across human time and culture. Its amazing how it was found other times in South African rock painting and Inuit carvings. It is even connected to the film The Matrix. Cave art is definitely something that I will be adding to my list of things I would like to experience in person.

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    1. 

       Jasmine Figueroa

       September 18, 2016

       Hi Natalie! I also had no idea that the caves were particular to specific rituals, and found it interesting how they were considered a place where they could separate their ordinary routines from the spiritual aspect of their lives. The “Broken Man,” also caught my interest, and makes me wonder just what served as inspiration to create this image that also caused it to be found in different cultures that were quite far apart in terms of distance, yet connected in the spiritual sense. Art has definitely always played an important part in our history, and continues to unite generations of people through the admiration of this breathe-taking cave art.

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    2. 

       Andrew Nguyen

       September 18, 2016

       Hi Natatlie,
       I thought it was really cool how caves in France were used as special occasions. In addition, I also thought it was really cool how there was hand prints within the caves. Most importantly the young boy was able to stumble among this piece of art. Imagine what was going through his mind after he observed these pieces of art within the caves. Lastly, I really did think the connection between the Matrix and Birdman was really cool. Thanks for sharing Natalie! 🙂

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46. 

    Ana Maya

    September 18, 2016

    I found this video to be very interesting! Cave art is beautiful, for it can depict stories that are thousands of years old. Marciel Ravidat, as mentioned by Mr. Zucman, was only 17 years old when he discovered this cave near Dordogne, France in 1940. In this complex and elaborate cave there is only one human figure out of all the hand prints, geometric and animal figures. That figure is known as the “Broken Man.” What fascinated me the most about this was the fact that this figure can be found in other prehistoric art, for example in the southern African rock painting of an impaled man and in an Inuit painting of self-impaled shaman. These figures have supposedly died and were reborn as an enlightened beings. At first I was a little creeped out by the fact that the only human figure in this cave was similar to other human figures found in other places, but now it makes me want to learn more about it. I would love to visit this cave if I’d ever get the chance.

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    1. 

       melissarios17

       September 18, 2016

       Hey Ana,
       I couldn’t agree more with you. It’s crazy how a 17 year old discovered the cave art near Dordogne, France. He was basically in Dordogne at the right time, because truth is someone else could have came in contact with the cave. However, it was Marciel Ravidate who came across some of the very first stages of how art was created. In addition, I also found the “Broken Man” painting in the most interesting for various reasons. It’s insane how it was found in other prehistoric art and not only in the cave from Dordogne, France and that it was found in a section were there was carbon dioxide. I hope one day, I get to explore and see an art cave for myself.

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47. 

    Carlos Villicana

    September 18, 2016

    Something I found really interesting about the video was how the paintings in the caves have continued to have influence to this day. The paintings were so beautiful even though, by today’s standards, the technology available then is incredibly primitive. So much so that one would not even consider calling them technology, but instead call them tools. I found it incredible that even so long ago people found ways to create such beautiful art that can be compared to work’s from today and not look awful. I thought this really spoke to the timelessness of great art and to the dedication of great artists. Great art lives on because artists do not settle for “good enough to finish.” The paintings in the caves have lived on and transcended across cultures because people have found meaning in them, just like the original artist(s) did. I looked at those paintings and have no idea how someone would be able to create those like they did, where they did, when they did. But they did. And they did it because they were inspired by whatever reason to share a message with others. That kind of craftsmanship and dedication is something I find more beautiful than even the result itself.

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    1. 

       seewhychris

       September 18, 2016

       I like that you brought up the art in these caves. I too, found it mesmerizing and intriguing to see how limited they were in tools and resources, yet they still found ways to express themselves simply through artistic passion and human ability. It makes me think about all the things we don’t need in the world. If these historical artists could create such beauty with nearly nothing compared to our modern day artists, I wonder what they would be able to do with the technology and tools that we have today? It inspires me and makes me want to create amazing art as well.

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48. 

    Linda Nguyen

    September 18, 2016

    This video on the Lascaux cave was very interesting! During the summer, I took a cultural anthropology class and the professor discussed the cave a little bit and showed us a video that took us through the caves. What captured my attention and still captures it now is the beauty of the Hall of Bulls. It’s amazing to see how humans in prehistoric times used art in ritualistic ways and it makes me wonder where else could prehistoric art works be found and wonder how many may be even lost forever due to the changes in water levels and the land over time. I always wanted to travel and going to the replica of the Lascaux cave is definitely on my bucket list for when I visit France one day.

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    1. 

       klauduso

       September 18, 2016

       Hello Linda,

       I also like how the Hall of Bulls was painted, the art that humans created in prehistoric times amazes me. For it to be created in a ritual and have the art come out to be amazing and incredibly simple but great is astounding. It’s sad to see that art will not always last forever. Paintings that has been created over a century ago are already beginning to fall apart. Soon or later, the paintings will cease to exist and not many people will ever see it again.

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    2. 

       Abigail Manuel

       September 18, 2016

       Linda,
       I also thought that the Hall of Bulls was one of the most interesting parts about the video. I love the fact that something as simplistic as a bull could mean so much to so many people. I love the fact that art can so closely connect to things such as religion and politics, it shows just how important preserving these artifacts can be. The fact that the Hall of Bulls is such a large artifact that actually has been preserved is fascinating.

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49. 

    duhmarkymark

    September 18, 2016

    Marcelo Ceballos Jr. – 1 pm

    It has always intrigued me how art can be preserved so well in nature, and in this case in caves. Being 16,000 years old you would think it would have been worn away but it has persisted and endured through time. I also like to think that the caves were used for special occasions and were made for a purpose with time and effort dedicated to making them look amazing. The vision quests and the carbon dioxide source is an interesting idea because it would make a lot of sense if a “supernatural” experience could have been caused by a natural phenomenon. As for the bird-man figure being depicted all over the world I remember being really intrigued about this idea earlier too. It reminds me of the book “Chariot of the Gods” by Erich Von Daniken which gives out the idea that a god figure came to earth and helped set in motion humanities rise. This idea is also explored in the Alien movies as well as the the more current Prometheus movie. Although this idea may be hard to think actually happen, it may be a possibility just because we as a species are still finding our place in the universe. Regardless if the cave paintings are connected to this idea, they are still beautiful and miraculous pieces of art.

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    1. 

       dschmitz137

       September 18, 2016

       Daniel Schmitz

       Hey Marcelo,

       I too thought it was really interesting how the “vision quest” hallucination type things could be explained through a combination of getting pumped up from some intense music and starting to feel funny from the carbon dioxide. It just one of the many examples of how supernatural things can be explained with a little but of detective work. It reminds me of the Salem Witch Trials, where there was an outbreak of witchcraft throughout the small town of Salem. However, after historians looked at the facts and evidence, the generally accepted cause of the “witchcraft epidemic” was really just some fathers telling their daughters to accuse their neighbors of witchcraft to get them in trouble with the law and maybe executed. That way the neighbor would lose their land and the fathers could buy it.

       The shaman/spiritual guide reminded me of Gandalf from everybody’s favorite fantasy series, Lord of the Rings. At first Gandalf is a relatively weak wizard that guides the fellowship through dangerous situations. Here he is called Gandalf the Grey. However, after traveling through the Mines of Moria, Gandalf fights the Balrog throughout the caves and mines, kind of like the shaman in the video (minus the Balrog of course). However, Gandalf and the Balrog eventually die after fighting for a long time, but then Gandalf is enlightened by the god named Eru and resurrected in the form of Gandalf the White (Saruman the White lost his privilege to be called “the White’ after he started being mean and evil, so Gandalf took his place).

       Gandalf then goes on to guide men, elves, and what’s left of the fellowship into overcoming the evil Sauron.

       Anyway, so Gandalf is another example of the “born-again spiritual guide”.

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50. 

    dschmitz137

    September 18, 2016

    Daniel Schmitz

    I’ve always been interested in history, so this talk was intriguing. First of all, when I think of a stereotypical cave painting, I think of a stick figure of a person with a stick figure bow shooting at a stick figure deer or stick figure woolly mammoth. Both the human figure and hunted animals would be the first two things ancient people would draw in my mind.

    Not only that, but when looking at those cave paintings they are surprisingly beautiful. Like I said before, I’ve always pictured stick figures and crudely drawn/carved images. But in reality they created beautiful, detailed landscapes along with full-figured animals. Very cool.

    I am a bit confused about the vision quest and spiritual stuff. As far as I understand, the shaman crawls deep down into those tiny tunnels to create paintings until he gets to the end. And then when he does get into the deeper, smaller tunnels he starts to feel funny from carbon dioxide and music/chanting. Then what? Is he expected to die down there and be reborn as a spiritual guide, or is he expected to return alive with some sort of new knowledge?

    I also learned a new fun fact about broken necks and erections, thanks.

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